>One More Pageant Mom Responds
>Here’s one more response from the pageant side: This letter is from the pageant mom who’s been corresponding with me via e-mail. I would assume that a lot of what I’ve written has totally pissed her off, but she’s been nothing but polite, so I’ll ask you all to be the same in your comments to her. In each section, she responds to various questions that I asked on behalf of all of us. Her words are in italics.
1) The whole “fake” thing: I don’t know… I think a lot of mom’s first impression is that their child doesn’t need the fake stuff – but then after you lose so much you either get the picture or quit or go to natural pageants. My daughter has been competing since she was 5 months old, and she didn’t start really wearing the makeup and hair until she was 2. For awhile, she balked at lashes, so we didn’t do them. But then she saw other kids getting them and she decided to have them, but only I can do them on her (she won’t let anyone else.) The hair is really no big deal, because the bulk of the work is on the wiglet or fall (it takes me about two hours to roll a fall and about 5 min to get it on her head and fixed) and it spares the child’s hair from damage from so much teasing and curling etc. I’m not crazy about the tanning, but she doesn’t mind it and we actually have our own machine; and now instead of damaging my skin, my husband tans me with it…
2) Yes, pageants are expensive. I have a professional job and make a very good living and my husband is in a solid trade. We can only afford 2-3 nationals a year, maybe 2-3 state level pageants, and a few locals here and there. And it’s not just money, it’s time. My son and husband play a lot of golf, so princess and I have this as our “girl thing” to do. Although my daughter is showing some interest in golf, but they won’t really start her at the club until she is 6 (she’s four.) A lot of other hobbies can be other-worldly expensive, so I don’t see the expense argument as a case against pageants.
3) No, I’m not too concerned about pedophiles. I noticed the comment about how you thought the gentleman with “Kennedee Belle” was looking at you with disdain, but he was probably checking you out – the pageant community is a very familiar group and we
are very wary of strangers (probably a journalist he thought.) Most of us know who the kids and their groups are and it’s a pretty tight community. If ANY stranger comes in, or we see anyone who doesn’t belong to someone participating, we immediately take notice.
Pageants are not put on for strangers or advertised as such for the very reason we don’t want a bunch of weirdos there. I don’t purport to be educated about pedophiles, but it seems like from the news they prey on kids that they have easier access too. I side with
the other mom, if anyone even looks at our kids funny it’s all we can do to restrain from tearing them from limb to limb. It would be interesting to have a thinktank do a study about how many pageant kids have been (for lack of a better term “attacked”) via pageantry. I respect facts, and so far really neither side of the love pageants/hate pageants has come up with any.
4) When they children are babies it’s not about them for sure; anyone who says differently, is not honest with themselves. My daughter is 4 and she is now getting to the point where she understands win/lose. The natural pageants are REALLY about who is the prettiest, vs glitz where it’s more about performance, smile, modeling, clothes etc. It’s hard to explain to a child that she lost because another child was actually prettier than her. It’s easy to explain “you need to pay attention on stage and look at the judges, or let’s get you a new dress, or you need to smile more…” Then they feel more in control of the situation. You can’t change what you were born with but you can improve your modeling and your clothes, and your smile etc. That’s hard to explain, but hey! I gave it a shot.
As far as “bribery”… I do give my daughter a small treat or gift after each competition she enjoys being on stage, but the treat is like the icing on the cake! I give my son small
monetary rewards or gifts for good grades or when he reaches certain goals for himself (homerun on the ballfield, or does well at a golf tournament etc.) I don’t much see the difference.
5) It’s funny, the mentality of the public is that pageant kids don’t do another damn thing. For some reason, I don’t know why, people think we lock our children up like “show dogs” or something. I think to only participate in pageants would definitely be unhealthy. Only doing one activity of anything is unhealthy if you ask me. I had a friend growing up who was heavily involved in ballet, and she was MISERABLE. She was extremely talented, but her mom-from-hell wouldn’t let her do ANYTHING else. So craziness can go for a lot of things. My daughter plays intramural soccer at school, she snow skis (started when she was 2 and she KICKS ASS on the slopes!!!) and she goes to dance lessons once a week. And the biggest title she ever won she had not one, but two skinned knees. I can’t do theatre with her because I work and it takes way too much time and we live too far from the city. Plus I hate those musty old theatres. I also hated girl scouts when I was a kid, if I never see another damn cookie it will be too soon. BTW back to the snow skiing, the director was just so all over about my daughter’s ability he was begging to have her back for some demo they were doing for the school (Lordy she was only 3.) When I told him she couldn’t because she had a pageant that particular week the look on his face was priceless!! And in a couple of weeks I’m taking BOTH of the kids to help volunteer at the Special Olympics (It’s a blast, you should try it.)
6) Like it or not, our society objectifies women. So instead of acting like it shouldn’t happen, I say meet the devil head on and deal with it. Know how to use what you have. And not sexually either so get your head straight on this. If appearances don’t matter, why take a bath and brush your hair to go to work? Why wear a suit to an interview? Do ties really add IQ points? These pageants aren’t just about who’s the prettiest, most often, it’s about who can make the most of what they’ve got. It sucks and its wrong, but it’s life. Both my kids go to private school, and I was actually “horrified” (if you can believe I am capable of that) because a mom in my son’s second grade class had dyed her child’s hair (and I did ask if she did pageants – the answer was NO and she was horrified about the thought). So lots of people can have mixed up priorities!!
7) Some of “The line” for me with pageants:
– screaming at your child or punishing them for “inadequate” performance
– spending way beyond your financial means
– telling your child she’s not pretty w/o her pageant items
– dying a child’s hair
– bashing and being ugly to others
– losing ungracefully
– winning ungracefully
8) About the respected “experts”, it really depends. If they come with FACTS I would consider it. If they come with opinions, I’m smart enough to make my own thank you after reviewing a LOT of information. I’ve had enough cases where doctors have been wrong to have a healthy disrespect for one or two opinions.
9) Finally, I’m a pageant mom who did pageants as a child – I didn’t start until I was 8 and it was my idea (had to BEG my parents to let me do one.) Unfortunately, adolescence was not kind and I had to be “talented” for a long time before I could be “pretty”. You want to hear a funny story, I tried FOREVER to WIN a pageant, and my first uh, “major” title (and I’ll give away who I am to a very select few if you print this) was Miss HELL HOLE SWAMP. And No, I didn’t make that up. Go Google it!!! Best thing that ever happened to me, but funny as well, hell.
10) Why glitz pageants? You won’t understand this answer for the life of you but we’ve done both – and frankly, the natural pageants just aren’t as much fun… there’s no excitement of having Mr. Tim sing to you (which my daughter gets sooo EXCITED about), the loud music, the momma’s hollering, the getting ready with all your friends, prissing down the hallway in your glitzy clothes, the big party on Saturday night, staying in a hotel room with other mom’s and your friends, going out to eat in big groups talking about how so-and-so did such-and-such on stage… I already KNOW my daughter is pretty so I don’t need to know if she can win naturally, I really don’t have to have that kind of acceptance. We went to a “middle of the road” pageant recently and they had little girls in the glitz pageant dresses w/o the hair and makeup etc. and frankly that looked weirder than with. So to end the tans and flippers etc. you have to end the loud music and the clothes and the sportswear and the routines…what would happen would be the end of glitz pageants. You just don’t have the level of fun and excitement at a natural pageant that you do at a glitz pageant. Now I can’t help it if you get a few mom’s or dad’s with mis-placed perspectives when they get there.
Another perspective on glitz in general: Years ago when I was involved in the Miss America program for our state (I went twice as a preliminary winner.) It was at the height of Miss America’s popularity (okay my age is showing LOL.) Back then the dresses were over the top glamorous, and we wore the tape under our boobs and had spectacular costumes and spectacular talents etc. There were wigs, and breast implants and every one of us was two bites shy of an eating disorder ;o) Swimwear was a higher percentage of our score too. Then the Miss America program decided they didn’t want to be a beauty pageant anymore and really pushed the whole “smart girls” in plain dresses. You had to get a platform and perform community service. You have to write an essay. It wasn’t as glamorous anymore. That’s great, but unfortunately on tv people don’t care you wrote a great essay, they just want to be entertained! It’s not “right” and it’s shallow and it’s not politically correct, but it’s human nature. And then they wondered why nobody wanted to watch anymore. However, if you think all the girls who participated back in my day became “bimbos” think again. A couple became doctors, my friend the ballerina owns a HUGELY successful dance school in the lower part of the state, I’m an IT manager for a large international corporation (I sooooo which I had stayed in something more bohemian though.)
I think the key here is that she was in pageants herself and viewed the experience as one of the best things that ever happened to her. That makes me understand why she, as a parent, is doing the same for her daughter. I think we all have that tendency.
But I see a great disconnect between what she’s trying to justify in her mind as “acceptable” and what truly is acceptable. Has she ever asked herself why her daughter’s ski instructor and the mother at her daughter’s school was so horrified by the idea of a pageant? Or why all of us, not to mention most of society, are horrified?
And she has a totally different take on the Miss America situation, too. When Miss America became less glitz and more serious, it was in response to a public outcry over the stupidity of the whole pageant, and the way it objectified women. She doesn’t appear to have grasped that at all.
Ironically, I found this flyer in some old mail yesterday.
>Yes—appearance *does* matter in our society but there is a huge gap between showering and putting on professional clothes for a job or interview, and doing the fake-tan-fake-hair-fake-teeth-fake-eyelashesplayboy bunny look. Yes—women *are* judged by their appearance far more than men, and there is a lot of societal pressure on women to achieve the slender, tanned, long-haired, long-lashed ideal. But what kind of lesson is it to teach your children to bow down to these ideals, instead of challenging them? I thank Pageant Mom for presenting her side of the case in such a civil, well-thought-out manner. But I really can’t be persuaded to believe that glitz pageants are a good thing for little girls.
>All else aside, I found this funny.(and I’ll give away who I am to a very select few if you print this) was Miss HELL HOLE SWAMP.I live close to Hell Hole Swamp. Heck, I have a picture of the most recent winner somewhere on my blog, July I think.
>I went to a small town Georgia parade once with a bunch of beauty queens from neighboring towns, including Miss Swine Time. AWESOME!
>I don’t understand why this pageant mom doesn’t challenge her daughter to rise above the importance society places on physical beauty. She, herself, admits that it is wrong, but then says it’s better to meet in the middle and teach the child how to use her attributes.That seems passive and ignorant to me. If our fore fathers and mothers had done that before us, there would be no woman’s rights, legal racial segregation and a myriad of other social issues running rampant through society.Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying pageantry is an evil to be compared with racism, but the attitude of not trying to change society’s shallow view of physical beauty simply because it merely exists, rings hollow to me.That said, I also would like to thank this pageant mom for standing up for what she believes in. I just don’t happen to agree with her.
>I meant illegal racial segregation.Oops!
>Yawn.Enough of this topic.
>Thanks for your view on things. I still dont understand the whole glitz thing. I dont understand how if you dont think your daughetr should have fake eyelashes at 2 but she wants them because she sees other girls with them, how you cave in, I think this is setting yourself up fpr problems in the future. I think its sad these girls have to wear fake anything. It dosent suprise me this mom was in pagents when she was younger….
>I don’t think this topic is yawn-worthy at all, it has so many layers and I think the increased exposure you’ve provided is admirable.I totally, 100% disagree with Pageant Mom, but am impressed with the civility in what can be such a heated issue.
>I did want to give this mom an opportunity to respond, since she’s been so civil and she took a lot of time to write down her thoughts- and I didn’t think putting her response in my comments was enough. So yes, the pageant saga drags on another day.
>Pageant Mom here… The only correction I would make to the “saga” is that I NEVER got “pissed off” and I think that needs strong correction. Also, I think I may now be inspired start my own blog ;o) I knew it would be difficult (and possibly impossible) to navigate the litany of literary vitriol, but hey! I need to improve my writing skills anyway. Regards!
>Her argument was well thought-out and well put…but no matter how anyone tries to justify it, I don’t see that these pageants serve any real purpose for such young girls.
>I feel so strongly against the pageant system (child, adult, natural, glitz – I don’t care) that I can’t comment on that without launching into a long-winded rant.I do, however, want to address our pageant mom directly in response to one comments:I’m not crazy about the tanning, but she doesn’t mind it and we actually have our own machine; and now instead of damaging my skin, my husband tans me with it…There is no way to get a tan using UV light that is not damaging to your skin. I have never been the type to spend a lot of time laying out, but I was diagnosed with skin cancer in my early 30s thanks to time I spent in the sun as a kid. Anyone who tells you that a tanning machine is safe is lying or misinformed. PLEASE – I am begging you – don’t put your daughter or yourself in one of those contraptions! It is not worth it.
>Okay, ONE more comment – esp to “where’s the coffee” (this is Pageant Mom a-gain) the tanning machine is a SPRAY-tan machine (using the sugar-based solution) LOL. I would NEVER put UV lights on myself or my daughter (good grief, I might be dumb but I’m not stupid ;o)
>Sorry Pageant Mom, I meant that I assume that a lot of what I’ve written has pissed you off. I changed the wording a bit in my post to reflect that.
>Well, I have to say that the mothers you’ve had here have had some pretty good points. I can’t say I’ve been swayed to think that pagents are “good”, but I HAVE been swayed to think that they aren’t “bad”. When I think about pagents, I’m sure I think the way that most people do. I think about little girls who probably don’t want to be there, and their crazy mothers forcing them to be there and do their thing. But the truth is, you see that in EVERY kid activity, be it soccer, child acting or modelling, ballet, and in Canada, HOCKEY. There are some psycho hockey mothers out there. The ones who yell at the refs and tell their kids to fight and hurt players on the other team. That being said, they are not the majority, and it’s probably the same with the pagents.I think one positive thing that this mother pointed out, is that her and her daughter have this special time together, and that in itself is something to respect. And the fact that the child is involved in other activities too. Pagentry might not be the best way to teach a child poise and self confidence, but is *A* way, and I have to say that in our society, our girls are lacking these important things.All this being said… I wouldn’t put my girl(s) into pagents, though I would put them in acting school and let them model. But only as long as they liked it. And I *Could* see some girls really enjoying the whole “princess for a day” thing. But, in my house, that day would probably be on their birthday, or Hallowe’en ;)This has been a fun series! Can’t wait to see what’s next!
>She made her points well and is obviously a very intelligent woman, but I still can’t agree. If we are striving to be better people, shouldn’t we teach our kids the difference between looking presentable and not being true to ourselves?I appreciate the time Pagaent Mom has taken, especially since she was unlikely to sway anyone to her point of view. But I will continue to agree to disagree and encourage both of my daughter to focus more on their natural talents (whatever they may be) and less on their looks.
>This pageant mom makes some good points, but one argument just doesn’t do it for me.She says that appearance matters in the real world. True, very true. What I don’t understand is how involving a child in the very unreal world of pageantry teaches them to function in the real world?
>I realize that there are probably really wonderful, caring smart people who enjoy these things, such as the woman who so thoughtfully wrote above. However, it seems to me this woman has got her kid’s iron in every fire that floats her boat: I noticed girlscouts or theater, though, weren’t her cup of tea so her daughter won’t ever have to endure such things.I think this is just something we should all just agree to disagree. She said it afterall:”It sucks and its wrong, but it’s life.I’d rather buck the trend. I hope my daughter will too, although I guess that will be her decision. When she’s old enough to make one.
>I don’t think anyone can dispute that women are judged far more harshly for their looks than men; what I question is why it’s okay in some peoples’ eyes to teach children (through pagents), that judging others and themselves on looks is okay. I say challenge it rather than than teach you kids it’s acceptable.
>Having sat next to the obsessive soccer mom, vicarious baseball dad, and stereotypical stage mom, I can see that abuses can happen in any area, not just pageants.I appreciate this new take, and this mom’s prior participation as a child (coming to it at the late age of 8) does allow her a bit of common sense about it. I’m happy to hear that she is working hard to help her daughter become a well-rounded individual.Unfortunately, just as I found in little league, she is surrounded by a bunch of folks who are just a bit… well… nutty.
>I am a pageant mom too. The TKO site goes down regularly to be updated – had nothing to do with anything here. BTW my 13 yr old son wants you ladies to know he rocks the stage at least one weekend a month competing, he loves any place to perform. How come no posts on how boys in pageantry are going to turn gay and become metrosexuals?? You are being very sexist with only bashing the girls and not the boys that compete in glitz. LOL
>Pageant Mom – Bravo! I truly enjoyed reading your post. Your words were better measured than what I have tried to answer on Lindsay’s blog. A few of them still do not understand that we are not attempting to sway them to join up. I saw Little Miss Sunshine tonight. It was difficult to sit through to the end so we could see all the people we knew in the movie. Watching that movie did help me understand a little bit better how the public views pageants. Everything “Olive” did at the pageant was pretty much what the public thinks happens at pageants. When “Olive” was on stage for swimwear and beauty I thought she was just a small town girl who didn’t know what Nationals were like. During “Olive’s talent” portion – The reaction from the pageant audience within the movie would be exactly the pageant communities reaction. Just after Olive started her…”talent” one hand rushed to my mouth and the other over my eyes! I was shocked! The other girls on stage were doing what they were suppose to do, be cute and talented (showing off their gymnastics, dancing, singing..) No pageant parent that I know would have their child learn a routine they did not know or approve personally. We are in the room when the are taught by their coaches. I want to let you know, I was not angry or upset in any way reading the responses or responding to this blog. I believe in “to each their own”, everyone has their own opinion, parents have the right to raise their children as they see fit (no one thing will work for every child). Our posts have been lengthy but to thoroughly answer all questions about pageantry a biography on all contestants past and present would have to be made and read. One thing that really made me laugh in the original post was about the girl scouts…are they turning us all towards pageantry? (giggling) Myself, my much younger sister, and both of my daughters were all treated poorly in girl scouts by the other girls but were doted on by the leaders . Each had to stick with it a full year before leaving. Girl Scouts can be wonderful but it is not for everyone, God Bless the girls who have great experiences.The other “Pageant Mom”
>To Anonymous: Actually, the site tko (which would really be “TNO” since they misspell the word “knockout” in their title) coming “down for construction” DID have something to do “with all this,” or so the editor of the Times was told by the upset mother of one of the 5-year-old girls pictured there. She made VERY clear that she was having the site disable directly inresponse to all the negative attention it was getting.And I have to applaud this most recent Pageant Mom for a job very well done in expression her viewpoint. There were no circular arguments, no “straw men,” no ad hominem argument…just a good job. Her “if you can’t beat ’em, join ’em” mentality makes me a little sad, as a woman, but she really did a great job in what could easily be considered a hostile environment.The Miss America comparisons didn’t do anything for me one way or the other, because those are grown women who can make their own decisions, not painted up toddlers who have no idea what’s really going on.I would still, nor would her father, ever, EVER have our daughter in one of those “Glitz” pageants (and all the things PM denoted as “positive” about the Glitz pageants as opposed to the Natural pageants could SO easily be duplicated in the Natural pageants–seriously, why NOT? Why not the loud music, lights, singing, audience support, etc.?), BUT, I can tell from the way she presented herself here, that Pageant Mom is someone I might enjoy being around, since she’s obviously smart, articulate, and has a sense of humor about herself and life in general. Just not at a pageant, please. ;-)Oh, and just for the record…not one of our show dogs has ever lived “locked up.” They get to be dogs, just like I hope that all the girls who participate in these pageants get to be kids. 🙂
>Good gosh, the typos in that comment above. I’m not even going to go back and fix them, but just apologize, and blame it on the painkillers and the late hour. Surgery in 5 days…wheee!’-)
>Thank you Pageant Mom…An anonymous commenter mentioned something about a bad experience in Girl Scouts. Everyone has a bad experience – everywhere. Even adult men and women. You can’t tell me that doesn’t occur in these pageants as well!
>Pageant Mom, for the record, I don’t think anyone believes that Olive’s experience was anywhere near realistic. The movie, funny as it was, had lots of plot holes, one of which was that no one would’ve seen Olive’s routine before it was performed. Also, I certainly don’t lump all pageant moms into the “fanatical stage mother” category (although I have to say I saw a LOT of them at the pageant I went to and noticed that unless they shared a pageant coach, many of the moms weren’t nice to each other at all), I will say that all pageant moms who put their young children in glitz pageants are wrong to do so. Before I went to a glitz pageant, I wouldn’t have said that. I am not anti-pageant. I grew up in the South. I love hair and makeup and think the idea of pageants is cute. I was prepared to go and laugh to myself and write a column about how kitschy the whole thing was (and that probably would’ve happened had I gone to the state fair pageant, like I had originally planned- the glitz pageant happened to be one weekend sooner, which was how I ended up going to that one).But I went to the glitz pageant and, well, you know the rest. I literally felt nauseated. I know as a mother and a woman that what I saw was wrong. And again, I’d encourage any of my female readers (particularly you moms) out there to go see one of these glitz pageants for themselves to see what I’m talking about if you’re curious.That said, I’m so glad we could have a civil discussion on both sides. This speaks to the power of women, I think, because in male-dominated forums, I’ve found it impossible to disagree with anyone without being personally insulted over and over again. I can disagree with someone without taking potshots at them personally- It’s nice to see that so many of you obviously feel the same way.
>I think what is most important here is that these moms take a step back from it all and view it from an outsider’s perceptive (aka, us – the ones who don’t agree with it). Lindsay saw the dancing, the one parent (or more!) who were obviously upset that their child “tanked” on her routine…the young children who are my daughters’ age that I still lovingly refer to as “the babies”. (yeah, I know, I need to get a new nickname)At the same time, I am trying to view it from their point of view…but I can’t. I have always taught my girls to, at the very least, try to be nice and not judge anyone around you, even if they’re not pretty/smell/wear bad clothes/whatever. Having these little girls in these pageants – isn’t that teaching them the exact opposite? Have you honestly been around a group of 8 year old girls when they didn’t know you were present? I live in a small town, and was shocked to see how mean these girls were to each other and other classmates. It was a real eye-opener. The parents may not judge other families who do not have their kids in these – but how do you know your children aren’t?
>I just wanted to stop in and congratulate you on winning your “Emmy” at Mysterious Lady’s award ceremony last night! 🙂
>Yeah, like you said, it still doesn’t seem like she gets the point. Her daughter started “competing” when she was 5 months old? See, that’s disturbing.
>I’m sure there are great parents around these things. But every parent who is a jerk is heard by the other folks’ kids, and that griping and berating makes an impact on every child in earshot. Because that’s how kids are. They extrapolate. They don’t always say anything, but I bet you money that for every pageant child with a hellish mother, there are five with kinder mothers who are secretly terrified that their mother will turn hellish if they really blow a routine. Not because of anything their own mother has done, but because they’re in that environment. And because the kids are put on the stage to compete, it’s all on them.And yes, the same is true in some sports leagues, but that doesn’t make it any better in pageants. I won’t put my young children in competitive leagues, no matter how much they beg, because I know as a parent that it would be unhealthy. Just like the pageants are, by their very nature, unhealthy.4 and 5 year olds, regardless of talent, aren’t mature enough for competition.And the idea that it’s all about the fun? Then why aren’t they just talent shows, where everyone is praised for participating and there are no winners/losers? Why are they judging? Kids that age are too young to be judged in that way. Period.
>(in response to Pageant Mom) Women will continued to be judged on appearances as long as there are parents like YOU who perpetuate that idea, instead of teaching your daughters that self esteem comes from what you do, not how shiny your wig is. Why not try to break the cycle? Because you’re shallow, self-absorbed and selfish for subjecting your daughter to such blantant sexism. Sickening.
>It’s great that Pageant Mom chose to present her side of the story. I appreciated the chance to read it.I won’t weigh in on pageants for adults or teens. Or local “natural” look pageants. But this glitz thing is just so, so wrong. For me, it’s not about whether the kids are ready for the committment, the level of competition, the overbearing mothers or coaches. You can see that in lots of things, including ice skating, gymnastics, etc. that require early, expensive, and total committment.What is deeply wrong is sexualizing children with adult hair, eyelashes, makeup, and performances. It is truly disturbing. BTW, THAT was the point of Little Miss Sunshine. Yes, it was silly and a plot hole that the family wouldn’t know about her act. But the concept is that what Olive was doing overtly with her act, was at least honest compared to what these girls were doing with their makeup, hair, clothes, and adult modeling poses. An over-the-top point in the movie, yes, but a realistic one.
>I think the activities you choose for your children to do should teach them life skills. What kind of life skills are they getting from pagents?
>Pageant Mom here LOL! (Okay I can’t resist) I’m curious, why does EVERYTHING have to be educational? I don’t expect pageantry to teach my child “life skills” I expect ME to teach my child life skills. That includes being able to take pageantry for what it is (NOT reality) and to take other things like school (IS reality) and to understand the difference. Again, it’s okay if you don’t like pageants… If everyone was wired the same way, the world would be a truly dull place now wouldn’t it? I have truly enjoyed the dialogue, and reading the various opinions on this subject!!
>The expense of the pageants is mentioned by pageantmom. One has to wonder how much $$$ the organizers are raking in?
>Pageant mom sounds like she’s got her stuff together and is doing a great job with her daughter. Pageants aren’t for me or mine, but to each their own. Good for you for defending yourself. Although I’d think twice about the tanning…that actually sounds dangerous to start that exposure so young.
>I’m very impressed with how you’ve been handling your comments back to these pageant moms. I don’t know if I could be so diplomatic. After reading all this exchange, I think a lot of it boils down to the fact that little girls are supposed to be “cute,” not “pretty.” When the second pageant mom said her daughter was pretty, that kind of hit me as the root of the problem, and it ties directly to what you said about little girls not being mature enough to understand that the poses and outfits and make-up launch them into a realm that is dangerous enough for teenagers, let alone for them. This has been really difficult to read, but I’m glad I stayed up to do it.
>I recently attended a “glitz” pageant in the Miss America circuit (Little Miss). I didn’t see anything wrong with this pageant. I didn’t see hair extensions, too much makeup, or fake teeth or lashes. In fact, the “overdone” girls didn’t win. What I saw were confident girls (we watched ages 6 and up compete) who were having the times of their lives playing dress-up and model . . .every little girl’s dream. I’ve never seen another glitz pageant in another circuit. I’d guess that, since they aren’t Miss America approved, they may be different. I had a problem with a swimsuit competition for girls under 18, but after seeing the competion, I realized the “swimsuits” are basically what my daughter wears as a “leotard” to dance class every week and I’ve never heard anyone gasp at seeing a bunch of dancing girls in their leotards. Plus, the swimsuit competion is one of the many “optional” events, so no one has to do it to win the crown for her age group. My point is that pageants vary from circuit to circuit. If one circuit bothers you, try another one before knocking pageants altogether. You may be pleasantly surprised and even have fun. Pageants are the one thing my daughter and I BOTH enjoy, so I never care if she wins or loses, and I never feel I’ve “wasted money” if she doesn’t walk away with the crown. It’s all in the name of making good memories and spending quality time with my daughter doing something fun.Thanks for all the information. We are varitable “newbies” on the “big” pageant scene, so we’ll watch out for the bad circuits and avoid them. Thanks again!
>My 5 yo dd has recently started competing in natural pageants. She was crowned Cinderella Overall Tot at a preliminary last month and is going to our state Cinderella pageant in June. She’s taken ballet and tap lessons for 2 years — I used to teach theater and thought this would be a good way to up her confidence (she tends to be very shy and doesn’t know how to answer questions people ask her, or how to introduce herself, and is really bad about smiling/acting friendly). Winning that pageant, and preparing for the next one, has done more for her confidence and friendliness than 2 years of dance ever did! She is becoming much more comfortable with people, answering questions when they’re asked of her, introducing herself warmy to people, and smiling all the time! Having said that, Cinderella is a very natural pageant system. THe girls wear Sunday dresses (my dd’s was a smocked Will’beth, tea length, if that gives you any idea, and her sportswear was a Rare Editions petticoat dress with a cardigan, knee-high socks, and mary janes), no hair extensions, no fake eyelashes, very conservative make-up (no more than what you’d wear for a dance recital), and dont’ do any pro-am modeling. A good portion of their score comes from an off-stage interview, and for ages 3-6 an on-stage interview done in place of a talent. I, personally, am turned off by the glitz dresses, wigs, fake eyelashes, spray on tans, heavy make-up, revealing sportswear, and modeling routines. Pageants are fun for me and my daughter, a day for her to wear 4 outfits in the span of an hour, have her hair done, and play with other girls her age. I want to keep it that way…
>I think pageants have evolved. I was participated in the Teen USA and National Teenager pageants and I go to an Ivy League school. It was a very different experience than what I expected since I only started doing them in college. The judges were not only interested in looks, but the research I’ve done, the scientific papers I’ve published, my sorority…etc.. I ended up winning a state title, and I hope the interview experience I gained will help me get into a great medical school. So, sometimes I think pageants get a bad rep, but not everything you hear about them and the girls that do them are true.
>I am not sure when this was made but i just wanted to put my 2 cents in. My daughter is 19 months old and I am a pageant mom. Of course i would NEVER put my daughter ina glitz pageant. I do think it is very wrong to put make-up on little bitty girls. I believe if you are going to put a child in a pageant it should not involve make-up. I understand she was saying that in glitz they are just more on personality and modeling and clothing. THEN WHY ALL THE MAKE UP! It makes these pretty little girls look like plastic dolls. I mean these girls should be emjoying there time as children not getting make-up put on them,fake eyelashes on them not fake tans. i mean come on. Yes as i said my daughter is in pageants. She has been in 4 pageants. Has 1 title to show for it. But i didnt put make up on her. Yes coming up for her state pageant she has a pageant dress but nothing glitzy.All in ALL i am saying girls should be girls and not little women.thanks 🙂
>Why aren’t YOU balking at putting make up on your child? Not okay at 5 months? Oh yes, 2 years old is much better. There is, in my opinion, no justification for prostituting your children. They perform, get money and parents take it.
>I DON’T GET THIS AT ALL . I HAVE NEVER SEEN MAKE-UP THAT DIDN’T WASH OFF , HAIR THAT WOULDN’T BE UNDONE , ETC . IT’S REALLY NOT THAT BIG OF A DEAL . I CAN TELL YOU FIRST HAND , MY DAUGHTER THINKS SHE IS QUITE BEAUTIFUL WITH OR WITHOUT ALL OF IT . HASN’T HURT HER SELF ESTEEM AT ALL , TRUST ME . I THINK THE BENIFITS OF PAGENTS OUTWEIGH THE NEGATIVES EASILY . IT IS BASED ON SKILL , AND LITTLE ON BEAUTY . I WISH THEY WOULD STOP CALING THEM “BEAUTY PAGEANTS” . GET YOUR HEAD OUT OF YOUR ASSES , AND REALIZE … YOU PROBABLY KNOW VERY LITTLE ABOUT WHAT YOUR TALKING ABOUT . THEY ARE AWESOME FOR MEETING FRIENDS , AND GAINING SKILLS , ACTUALLY HAVING AN OPPORTUNITY TO SHOWCASE YOUR TALENTS . WHEN THESE LITTLE ONES ARE ON STAGE , IT’S ALL ABOUT THEM . THEIR DAY TO PLAY STAR . SHE MUST NOT MIND THE MAKE-UP TOO MUCH EITHER . I HAVE TO HIDE MINE CONSTANTLY SO SHE DOESN’T PLAY DRESS UP ALL THE TIME . FROM MY EXPERIENCE , THE ONLY PEOPLE THAT ARE OFFENDED BY THE SIMPLE FACT THAT YOU DO HAVE TO LEARN HOW TO CARRY YOURSELF PROPERLY , DRESS UP WHEN IT’S NECESSARY , AND YES – DO YOUR BEST AT PRESENTING YOURSELF WELL INSTEAD OF LOOKNG LIKE A SLOB ARE REALLY UGLY DEPRESSED PEOPLE THAT NEVER LEARNED HOW TO BEST REPRESENT THEMSELVES . USUALLY PEOPLE THAT DON’T HAVE GOOD SELF-ESTEEM THEMSELVES . WHILE YOU MAY THINK IT’S ODD FOR THEM TO DRESS UP , I UNDERSTAND . I — USE TO SAY THEIR WAS NOOO WAY I WOULD PUT ALL THAT ON MY LITTLE DARLING . THEN I REALIZED , WHAT’S THE HARM ? IF SHE WERE IN A PLAY , OR DOING ANYTHING ON A STAGE FOR THAT MATTER ,GUESS WHAT – SHE WOULD BE REQUIRED TO WEAR MAKE – UP , AND DRESS UP FOR THE PART . IT’S THE SAME . THEY LIKE TO ACT FANCY , AND MIMIC THE BIG GIRLS . IT’S REALLY A LOT OF FUN . GET OVER IT FOLKS , IT ALL WASHES OFF AS SOON AS THEY LEAVE THAT STAGE . BUT HERE I AM TRYING TO TALK SENSE INTO A FOOL .
>Wow. You seem like a great mom.